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Let's End the Charade. Leach's Firing is not about Concussions.

At the risk of stating the obvious, Coach Leach was not fired because of his negligent handling of a player’s concussion.

In my opinion, Leach was terminated for two reasons: 1) Texas Tech's Administration had grown tired of him, and 2) the Administration and the Athletic Department's financial supporters did not wish to fulfill their contractual obligations to Leach.

To achieve this end, the Tech Administration opportunistically leveraged a dim-witted media personality and his disgruntled son to create a pretense for Leach's dismissal.  The Administration, according to its statement,  suspended and later terminated Leach  because of his alleged "treatment of a player after the player was diagnosed with a concussion" (whereby) "the player was put at risk for additional injury."

The story about Leach's alleged mistreatment of the concussion, however, has been unravelling from the start. 

The Tech Administration and certain media interests (one ESPN), recognizing that the pretense has not withstood even cursory scrutiny, have rushed to obfuscate the arguments by tarnishing Leach’s reputation, making unsubstantiated generalizations about Leach’s handling of injured players and alluding to tantilizing ‘other’ reasons for his dismissal  - none by the way which are mentioned in his termination letter.   

Let us now shed further light on this comedy of errors by examining the facts of concussions in general and Leach's handling of the concussed player in question.

Star-divide

Fact 1:  Mild Concussions are actually hard to diagnose.

Concussion or mild traumatic brain injury (MTBI) is common among most contact and collision sports participants. For many physicians, even those who specialize in MTBI, this area is confusing due to the paucity of scientific evidence to support much of the clinical decision making that is faced in the office.

Source:  http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/92095-overview

Fact 2:  There appear to be no universally accepted guidelines for diagnosing, managing or treating concussions.

At least 16 different guidelines for the evaluation of concussion have been proposed. The plethora of guidelines reflects the lack of consensus, which results from the absence of evidence-based data.

In 1986, Cantu formulated a set of guidelines that became widely used; it was subsequently adopted by the American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM). In 1991, the Colorado Medical Society Guidelines were formulated in response to several deaths secondary to head injuries in Colorado high school football players. These guidelines are more restrictive than previous versions; they were subsequently adopted by the National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA). Most recently, the American Academy of Neurology (AAN) proposed another set of guidelines. Currently, no consensus exists within the sports-medicine community as to which set of guidelines is the most appropriate.

Source: American Association of Family Physicians, http://www.aafp.org/afp/990901ap/887.html

Fact 3: Mild concussion symptoms appear to be well known.

Headache is the most common MTBI symptom. Other symptoms include dizziness, vomiting, nausea, lack of motor coordination, difficulty balancing, or other problems with movement or sensation. Visual symptoms include light sensitivity (emphasis added), seeing bright lights, blurred vision, and double vision. 

Sources:  Archive of Internal Medicine, Journal of Athletic Training, Journal of Emergency Nursing.

Fact 4:  There appear to be no specific treatments for mild concussion (this is my favorite section).

Usually concussion symptoms go away without treatment and no specific treatment exists. 

Source:  The Harvard Medical School Family Health Guide and Current Treatment Options in Neurology.

Treatment for concussion includes the elimination of all physical activity and the elimination of all cognitive stimulation (relatively new) (Annual National Summit on Concussion and Other Sports Medicine Injuries, May 15, 2009). This includes the removal of student-athletes from school with instructions of no reading, no computers, no video games, and no texting/communication on electronic devices. (emphasis added) The goal of removing the cognitive stimulation is to allow the brain to heal. Just as in any other type of injury, rest is crucial to the healing process especially within the first 48 hours.

Because some individuals may experience photophobia (sensitivity to light) with a concussion, placing the athlete in an area void of sunlight or artificial lights may make the athlete more comfortable (emphasis added).

However, a key part of ensuring the safety of an athlete diagnosed with a concussion is to never leave the athlete unsupervised or alone (emphasis added). Athletes recovering from concussions need constant monitoring to ensure that no other symptoms appear that may indicate a more serious brain injury (subdural hematoma).

Source:  http://sportsinjuries.suite101.com/article.cfm/recovering_from_a_concussion.  Terry Ziegler, Professor of Kinesiology

 

Leach and the Concussed Player

Using the preceding discussion about concussion management in general, let’s see where that places Leach vis-a-vis his handling of the particular concussed player:

1.     The science of minor concussions is imprecise

2.     The guidelines for treating minor concussions are not universally accepted

3.     There are no specific treatments for minor concussions

4.     In the event that a patient suffers light sensitivity, one professional publication suggests "placing the 

        athlete in an area void of sunlight or artificial lights" 

5.     The publication also suggests to never leave the patient unsupervised

Regarding points 1-3, Leach deferred decisions regarding diagnosis and treatment of the player's concussion to doctors and trainers, who in the execution of their duties adhere to medical guidelines which are not universally agreed upon.

Regarding point 4, Leach requested that the player, who was diagnosed as suffering from light sensitivity, to be placed in a dark area - in accordance with the advice of at least one sports medicine publication.

Regarding point 5, Leach advised that the player be monitored at all times - in accordance with the advice of at least one sports medicine publication.

Final Thoughts

I am failing to see, based on the above discussion, how Leach’s actions a) put the player at substantial subsequent risk to injury; and b) deviated from the normal medical standard of care (especially as there is not a universally accepted standard of care regarding MTBI)  which Dr. Michael Phy referred to in his affidavit. 

Let it be asked here. Once the artifice for Coach Leach’s dismissal has been exposed, where does the Tech Administration go from here?  Let’s hope heads roll.

ESPN and other national sports journalists please take note.

Other references:  2009-2010 NCAA Sports Medicine Handbook Guideline 2i, Concussion or Mild Traumatic Brain Injury (mTBi) in an Athlete (revised July 2009).

 

 

Comment 119 comments  |  2 recs  | 

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Shed...light.... tee hee great post btw
Let us now shed further light on this comedy of errors by examining the facts of concussions in general and Leach’s handling of the concussed player in question.

¡Viva los Matadores!

by jwhitettu on Jan 4, 2010 9:28 AM CST reply actions  

Outstanding Work!!!

Excellent.
I wonder if the Tech admins think we are all dumb a$$es?
I know there are things that go on behind closed doors that the public will and shouldn’t ever be made aware of, but for the high hats at Tech to think that the fan base would swallow such swill is dumbfounding to me.
I couldn’t be more humiliated if they had slapped me!

by Llanonite on Jan 4, 2010 9:29 AM CST reply actions  

Yes, yes they do.

As far as they are concerned the students, thereby the alumni are cows to be milked and slaughtered for monetary gain, either for the University (themselves) or for athletics (themselves). To think otherwise is to endow the “cattle” with intelligence.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 6:21 AM CST up reply actions  

are they Mizzou grads?

"I’ve established a reputation for integrity. I have maintained those high standards" - Craig James

by TechFirst on Jan 5, 2010 8:30 AM CST up reply actions  

I must assume that they assume that we are.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 12:23 PM CST up reply actions  

outstanding research

Way to go LondonRaider. Nice work.
I have said all along this is about the money.

by blackbeard on Jan 4, 2010 9:33 AM CST reply actions  

+1

Again I say somehow we need to take this a step further. How can we get someone to file for and “Open Records” reqest for Gerald Myers emails over the past two years. I believe this would further embarass the administration and reveal the group that wanted to get rid of Leach. For the administration to properly support a new Head Coach, (we are going there wether we like it or not so we have to accept it), it has to be evaluated in the public and this is how we are going to be able to do that. Thanks to Seth for trying to keep our heads cool.

by cweber7377 on Jan 4, 2010 9:50 AM CST reply actions  

All that has been long deleted beyond anything except some top secret gov't recovery program,

which they aren’t about to pull out for this case. It’s not like he was porking his secretary or anything.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 6:23 AM CST up reply actions  

Like it or not (and I don't)

Tech was legally justified in firing Leach over the “dark shed” incident. They’ve got their “for cause,” and it’s going to stick.

In this day and age, to your average Joe on the street it smacks of torture.
Running bleachers until you puke? That’s part of football.
Yelling obscenities? The same.

Placing a player in a dark room—which has no apparent benefit other than the motivation of humiliation? This is different.

If Leach had been on good terms with the AD/BoR, would they have fired him over this? No. Nevertheless, Leach provided sufficient legal cause for his dismissal, and therefore, it doesn’t matter that they were looking for a reason to fire him.

by Shallowater on Jan 4, 2010 9:52 AM CST reply actions  

I don't like it either

unfortunately coaches now are faced with the need to discipline and instill work ethic in players and I think that is what Leach was going for…I think perhaps he should have been given a little more leeway in that dept but what is done is done…the admin were looking for a way to ship Leach out and they got it…I just wish they had handled it a little better..it makes them look inept and reflects poorly on the school….a national media scandal was not what we needed

had they have paid him the 800k let him coach the bowl game and then fired him..there would probably not have been as much negative media on the issue

by jdangler on Jan 4, 2010 10:20 AM CST up reply actions  

The head lines might have been something like ‘Paid $800,000 bonus and fired.’

I is difficult to look good in the circumstances, no matter what one does.

I believe the entire admin, BOR, and even the secretaries knew they were going to look bad as a result, they did what they thought they had to do…what ever the motive.

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 10:26 AM CST up reply actions  

true

Not really any good way to do it was there…

by jdangler on Jan 4, 2010 11:17 AM CST up reply actions  

I don't like it either

On its face, and under the letter of the contract, the items cited might constitute “cause”. Tech’s problems, as I see it, are that the e-mails published in the DMN and the timing of the dismissal vis a vis the completion bonus deadline, are classic examples of pretextual evidence. It does matter that they were looking for a reason to fire him. If so, and they were motivated by acrimonious contract negotiations and Leach’s exercise of his legal rights, as opposed to his treatment of a player (which had not been acted on when it was B. Knight choking Prince), then it won’t stick. I would hate to be the lawyer who told the 3 Stooges that it would stick.

by Oklahoma Red Raider on Jan 4, 2010 12:19 PM CST up reply actions  

Sports Lawyre from Harvard(?).....

This morning here in Jackson, MS a Sports Lawyer who works for SI and a former Law Professor here in town was on a local show and his take is that TTech will be paying Leach probably @ least $2.8M (5yrs x $400,00 + $800,000 bonus) + any damages they can prove….The way this Admin. just sped up the process and does seem to fall in Leach’s favor….Plenty of blame here to go around and Thanks LondonRaider for the great summation….It is all just so painful/sad….Wreck’Em Tech

by techgolf44 on Jan 4, 2010 10:05 AM CST reply actions  

Damages

I agree, except that Leach has a duty to mitigate his damages. If he can find another job (e.g. offensive coordinator at A & M), what he makes from that job would be subtracted from what he was entitled to under the contract. Still should be a significant payday for Mr. Leach.

by Oklahoma Red Raider on Jan 4, 2010 12:22 PM CST up reply actions  

And then...

…there is the slander to his reputation to defend!

by Llanonite on Jan 4, 2010 2:40 PM CST up reply actions  

It Never Was About Concusion

It started with mistreating the players…putting him in a shed/garage/trainer-gardener storage, ice house, OL spa.

He was fired because he was a difficult employee, devisive in all contract situations, with an annual trip (even if he had to pay for it out of his own pocket ) to a school looking for an HC inorder to use it as leverage as perceived marketability as an HC in demand…a fundamental lie, one that the admin had to handle annually as a hostile negotiation. He was fired because he refused to find a middle ground, even if it was to his benefit at the end of the day. So he would strike out to win a battle only to find himself losing the war.

Once they determined to use James as a reason…did they know he would refuse to sign an apology ?? Then they had cause, which Mike Leach gave them, so for his principle, he gave up the income that he had worked so hard to gain, the security of each of his assistant coaches, and the work that he and they had expended to get the program at the level it has gained. But he does have his prinicple…what is that principle anyway ?

Mike Leach further shows his ‘loyalty’ by telling stories that conflict with the trainer’s, and team doctor’s affidavites…at least that is the way it looks…and the way it will look in court. Now, the affidavites themselves might be questioned. They are both dated 1Jan2010, were they tendered under duress? Is there a subtle, hidden threat of job security behind them ? We will never know, but they can be offered in court as valid and tested in that arena as a ‘my word against yours’ offering for a civil court to decide.

When I heard ML was given a letter at the hearing, I knew the admin was ready to fire him and they knew he would possibly give them cause, again. He thought he could get away with sueing his employer’s admonishment tendered because he refused to sign an apology without further admonishment ?? That is insane, even reckless !! It speaks of a vindictive response, a narrow view of the world outside of his own judgement, inability to compromise or even look at a middle ground when everything is at stake.

Mike Leach is a very fine football coach and program leader, he assembled a good cast of coaches, and helped grow a good football program, but he was an horrible employee and that did him in at TTU and his further pursuit of the direction he has displayed will be considered by any worthwhile program that wants to hire a good coach. He was not in demand while he was leading TTU and while he was percieved to be in good light with his admin, I cannot see where he is helping his marketability by continuing to fight for that contract money.

And, yes—with a duh!, if you have made up your mind to take the opening given by the James affair to fire your coach, you do it before he is eligible for any completion bonus.

The whole deal is an ugly mess, it shows that the TTU admin is not going to deal with a difficult coach…it reeks of ugliness because they fired him in a way that saved the school as much money as possible…perhaps with some risk of losing some of that for legal fees. We all would rather see something more ‘concrete’ as a reason for fire someone. Insubordination will more often than not get someone fired…Mike Leach was repeatedly insubordinate in this affiar and has lost his career or at the very least put it at great risk as a result.

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 10:14 AM CST reply actions   2 recs

I think objectively and unemotionally, I agree with a lot of this. But this won’t be real popular ; )

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 10:18 AM CST up reply actions  

Thank you 92.

I am sad that Mike Leach is gone.

Honestly he has brought such wonderful accomplishment to the Red Raider football program…what could we have seen had he been a little more willing to work with the admin on some of these really smaller things…he could have apologized to the ‘Adamses’ and still worked his basic ideas about coaching and just gotten a little bit smarter in how to handle players who were not doing their part to be team. (something he was unable to accomplish himself…such irony !!)

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 10:24 AM CST up reply actions  

I credit him with sticking to his guns on the no apology angle…but it got him fired. I think we’ve all had to make a choice at some point in our life about the battles we choose to fight. Mike chose this one and is now in a tough, tough career spot. I’d be surprised if a BCS conf school hired him for his next job.

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 10:30 AM CST up reply actions  

I think they would have fired him

if he had signed the letter, because it would be an admission of wrongdoing. It was a no-win deal for ML.

by Shallowater on Jan 4, 2010 10:36 AM CST up reply actions  

Yeah, they were playing high stakes poker and they totally backed ML into a corner. They used what they felt they had, but nobody thinks they weren’t going to fire him anyway. They just had to use the most defensible mechanism.

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 10:41 AM CST up reply actions  

Nice Summation

I too love the exctiement that Leach brought to the program, the attention and poular follwing not to mention the uncredited change of how college football is played the transformation of the Big XII offensive systems.
I would just like to add that this is a three sided story. The kid and his family have a claim, Coach Leach has a stance and the administration has a stance. The fact that Mike Leach was unable to at least admit that there might be a problem and was unwilling to have his point of view questioned. That completed his chapter. The claims that he deserved more money based on manufactured demand is what started the divide. West Texas live life in a world where loyalty has more respect than other parts of the world. Be it a more honest life or an old boys closed mined attitued it exists and we all knew that these trips to court other women werent going to go over well. Now that we know most of them were just exzaggerated that says more about Leach than it does Tech.

by Gus Mitchem on Jan 4, 2010 11:10 AM CST up reply actions  

You've got to stand for something, or you'll fall for anything

Lose/Lose situation so stick to your “guns.” I appreciate that Mike didn’t have to compromise his morals or alter them to fit the James Gang’s ideals. Most people admire a man of oak compared to a cottonwood tree that looks intimidating but will crumble at the first harsh wind.

by rpowel2 on Jan 4, 2010 12:26 PM CST up reply actions  

Employers typically have a statement on their disciplinary write ups that basically says “my signature does not imply agreement or disagreement or an admission of wrongdoing, It only documents that the situation has been discussed with me.” Employees are then allowed to write a response of some sort in which they can can deny any and all allegations against them. I’d like to see the letter that they asked him to sign.

"Life's a garden, dig it."

by Remington870 on Jan 4, 2010 1:10 PM CST up reply actions  

If you look back at the fanposts at the time, someone attached a copy of the letter.

"I’ve established a reputation for integrity. I have maintained those high standards" - Craig James

by TechFirst on Jan 4, 2010 1:56 PM CST up reply actions  

I agree with you TallMike

Sucks to have to admit it but most of what you stated makes perfect sense. It’s too bad Leach couldn’t just work this relationship a little better. I still don’t agree with the admin. firing him because even though he is difficult he was winner. I think he would have parted ways with Tech eventually in a matter of time with things the way they were.

"You've got to find your inner pirate" - Mike Leach

by Raider1992 on Jan 4, 2010 12:05 PM CST up reply actions  

TallMike, are you sure this "started with mistreating the players"???

Doesn’t the storyline begin when Tech is pressured by public outcry to sign a contract with Leach, which leaked email demonstrates they never intended to honor?

I’m not sure if it’s illegal to conspire to fire an employee so that you don’t have to pay a contract you signed with him, but it damn sure oughta be…. :-(

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 12:58 PM CST up reply actions  

What I meant

is the final chapter of Mike Leach’s saga. The closing chapter as we read it now.

From what I gather, it may have started in the days of stamps.

by TallMike on Jan 5, 2010 12:04 AM CST up reply actions  

Thanks very much for putting this out there

TallMike – I have been contemplating trying to find a way to place this perspective on the DTN blog for a few days. There are a LOT of folks who will find this view difficult to swallow. I very much appreciate you stepping up – in a big way.

There is no doubt that Leach is a football genius is beloved by Tech football fans and does have a unique character and personality. However, all those good traits don’t necessarily support a fully-formed, easy-to-manage employee … those traits are generally associated with a free-form, entrepreneurial, imaginative-type who wants to play by the rules “as they see them”.

Anyone who believes that the admin had a bug in their britches about Leach, simply because he was not “cut from the same cloth” of the West Texas pattern, should take a few steps back to see the big picture. The admin is loaded with a lot of folks who have invested a lot of themselves and their careers in Texas Tech, and were intimately engaged in the daily management (or failure to manage) of a very high-profile, well-liked, but eccentric and difficult employee.

I am sure the decision to remove him was NOT taken lightly or without considering the implications, but it would sure seem to me that Leach really opened the door for his own firing by … well, just being himself, unyielding in his view that his way was the ONLY way. It’s always laudable when someone has the “courage of their own convictions”. But, it does not do anyone any good to be unable to see another side, an alternative, or a compromise that can enable all sides to “win” in a situation where it appears that perhaps your own actions contributed to a tough situation (like the one introduced by the James Family), even if it was not your intention to do so.

"Fearless champions ever be; Stand on heights of victory"

by Let's Go Tech! on Jan 4, 2010 1:28 PM CST up reply actions  

Admin didn't have a "bug in their britches"? Oh REEEEEALY

How have you missed the email that shows there was never intent to honor the contract…

http://i.imgur.com/i6jzQ.jpg

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 1:36 PM CST up reply actions  

I disagree

Some people are running with these comments that were made during a difficult time in the process. Leach was being difficult, our regents were fighting back. If you put things in the context that Leach was asking for Mack/Bob type of contract and trumping up his own demand and manipulating public opinion falsely . I dont think its malicious to say that “I hope he doesnt sign”

At the time of the dispute it seemed that Leach was going to have new rumors every offseason. If Leach was so committed to his job then why would he constantly have reports of these interviews circulated by his agents.

Looks more like a Im going to break up with you before you can break up with me situation.

by Gus Mitchem on Jan 4, 2010 3:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Then come out and say we fired him because he was an a@@hole.

Beating around the bushes and fabricating reason will get you into trouble every time just ask my 10 year old son.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 6:33 AM CST up reply actions  

Respectfully Disagree with TallMike
It started with mistreating the players…putting him in a shed/garage/trainer-gardener storage, ice house, OL spa.He was fired because he was a difficult employee, devisive in all contract situations, with an annual trip (even if he had to pay for it out of his own pocket ) to a school looking for an HC inorder to use it as leverage as perceived marketability as an HC in demand…a fundamental lie, one that the admin had to handle annually as a hostile negotiation. He was fired because he refused to find a middle ground, even if it was to his benefit at the end of the day. So he would strike out to win a battle only to find himself losing the war.

The above, while likely true, are not legal grounds for termination. Leach did NOT have a recorded history of mistreating players, to my knowledge. And, Leach likely CAN show a record of modest insubordination which had never led to termination in the past. From my knowledge, if you have a history of letting an employee behave in a certain way for 10 years, you can’t suddenly revert back to an austere interpretration of his contract, especially if it subverts due process. The court will look back at the pattern of behavior under the contract to understand how the parties worked together, especially for a contract as ambiguous as Leach’s. There was an established and accepted pattern of behavior in the working relationship between Leach and the corrupt admin. It further appears that Leach has a great case to prove that Tech entered his new contract with unfaithful intent.

by DFWTrojan on Jan 4, 2010 1:45 PM CST up reply actions  

I feel a rip in the space-time continuum

I actually agree with DFW, even though I’m a Bruin and he’s a …. (In a neutral country I won’t go into the usual mantra.) To me, this entire fiasco may have a silver lining. It could mean permanent, lasting peace in the Middle East, if it could get a trOJie and a Bruin to line up on the same side.

(DFW, please don’t tell the guys at Bruins Nation that I agreed with you on anything. I have a reputation to uphold.)

by Fox 71 on Jan 4, 2010 2:16 PM CST up reply actions  

You act like Mike Leach managed a Whataburger for you and he got a big head after his store lead the region in sales. Contract negotiations in football don’t parallel much else in life. The fact that the administration was trying their best to make those negotiations as difficult as possible, makes the "difficult employee" argument even harder to make.

You also state "all contract situation". How many contracts do you think this guy signed at Tech? Do you have some information about his first contract negotiations that we don’t have. Please cite the source. We’re sticklers about that around here.

As for his "annual trip" to look for a new job, I would love for you to cite some sources. You will not be able to find one for every year or even every few years. The few you will find will be from a time when he was one of the lowest paid, yet most successful, coaches in the conference.

Did you read the "apology" that Leach did not sign? I’m not sure I would have given this administration a loaded gun like that. You seem upset that he didn’t give them an easy out so he could be fired without the risk of lawsuit.

Few will knock you for remaining a fan. I just ask that you don’t play to widespread ignorance when as you try to rationalize it.

by Quatroux on Jan 4, 2010 2:48 PM CST up reply actions  

Please recognize

that I am not trying to defend Mike Leach, the Admin, or the James family.

Personally I have no dog in this hunt.

I do want to understand myself some of what transpired and why.

Everything I have written, except my own simple attempts at humor, are repeated from thoughts I got while reading the emails from the DMN and other similar documents…and then put into my words so that I could express the thought.

I personally know of the reported trip to talk with Miami, the reported trip to talk with Auburn, and the reported trip to talk with the school in Washington…there may be another, that is what I remember in this moment.

I have a notion that the Admin kind of expects Mike Leach to sue, that is pretty easy to predict. Whether the apology is a loaded gun or not, I don’t know. It was referenced by Hance…so I took it as one of his reasons.

by TallMike on Jan 5, 2010 12:13 AM CST up reply actions  

If their mind was made up...

…a year ago that they would get rid of Mike Leach one way or another, why did they give him a substantial raise with a contract extension, and then do their best to humiliate him and cheat him out of his money?
Leach himself said in his ESPN interview that had the admins told him they didn’t want him anymore he would have agreed to an exit strategy that would be amiable to all.
Why the deceit on the part of Texas Tech?

by Llanonite on Jan 4, 2010 2:48 PM CST up reply actions  

Fairly obvious Llano

They did NOT intend to offer him a contract last year, but if you remember there was tremendous public pressure at the time from fans, so instead of taking the honest way out (not extend his contract) they gave me a contract the never intended to honor.

Again, if this ain’t illegal, it oughta be…

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 2:53 PM CST up reply actions  

They didnt want to fire him last year

They just wanted a reasonable contract, reasonable for his performance and as reasonable for the limits of our atheletic department. The fans (me included) wanted to do whatever was possible based on our passion, Mike wanted to trade on that passion and have that included in his dollar amount.

by Gus Mitchem on Jan 4, 2010 3:57 PM CST up reply actions  

Then don't offer the contract.

But the real blow to your argument Gus is this quote…

“You should offer a contract that wouldn’t cost us too much to fire him”

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 4:17 PM CST up reply actions  

My responses:

I’m reaching the point of just putting this entire thing behind me, but you’ve raised some interesting questions that I’ll respond to.

He was fired because he was a difficult employee, devisive in all contract situations, with an annual trip (even if he had to pay for it out of his own pocket ) to a school looking for an HC inorder to use it as leverage as perceived marketability as an HC in demand…a fundamental lie, one that the admin had to handle annually as a hostile negotiation. He was fired because he refused to find a middle ground, even if it was to his benefit at the end of the day. So he would strike out to win a battle only to find himself losing the war.

I don’t think much of this is wrong, but I think it is a drastic oversimplification to cite Leach’s wandering eye and inability to find middle ground and then conclude “he was a difficult employee” worth firing. An employee’s difficulty is not the sole consideration in the employment relationship. Where the person’s job is to produce wins at a clip considerably higher than other coaches in this school’s history, a certain amount of difficulty should be tolerated. The gist of those who think the school erred is that they made a bad decision because the cost of having Leach (which you’ve pointed out is substantial) is greatly outweighed by the cost of firing him. Here, many of us thought that the school was better off with Leach, warts and all, than we are without him.

It does little to dissuade that position to simply say that Leach had identifiable faults. We can, and indeed did, price in his wandering into our employment contract with him. Ostensibly the problems you identified, such as his inability to find middle ground, were likewise priced into the contract. If Mike Leach were a perfect employee, we probably would have had to pay him more. That’s just the nature of negotiation. We set a price on how valuable Mike Leach was to the program, warts and all.

Once they determined to use James as a reason…did they know he would refuse to sign an apology ?? Then they had cause, which Mike Leach gave them, so for his principle, he gave up the income that he had worked so hard to gain, the security of each of his assistant coaches, and the work that he and they had expended to get the program at the level it has gained. But he does have his prinicple…what is that principle anyway ?

Again, I think this is a dramatic oversimplification. Leach’s refusal to sign a letter may or may not have provided cause for the administration to fire him; that’s a legal matter, one I’ve not heard is clearly in favor of the administration by any lawyer. The general consensus I’m gathering from that community is that this thing is going to settlement. Leach will probably be entitled to no less than the 800k he would have had last Thursday, under the contract (on a summary judgment motion, probably, which tells me his worst day in court, at least by his lawyer’s lights, will be no amount less than 800k + attorney’s fees, unless they are precluded under the contract, which I’m not sure they are). Whether Mike Leach gave up anything is a matter to be decided, if it comes to that, by a jury or judge or both, but not by us. It might be the case that Mike Leach is far, far better off for refusing to sign the letter than he would have been had he signed the letter, not as a matter of “principle” but as a matter of economic well-being. We will see.

But principle is involved; I fault no person for refusing to sign an admission of illusory wrong-doings. I am fairly certain that Mike Leach did not handle the situation as politically as he possibly could, but I’ve no idea whether that would’ve even mattered. If the admin had made the decision to get rid of Leach, as you state they did, then why would his political posturing have mattered at all? Once the employer has determined that the employee will be fired, the employee’s duties are substantially altered. If the admin was just looking for an excuse, why be political? Doesn’t signing a letter of admission of mistreating a players provide precisely the kind of evidence of “for cause” firing that Leach might be, legally, afraid of? I would urge you, strongly, to consult a lawyer anytime your employer demands that you sign an admission of misconduct, particularly if it relates to contractual provisions with either hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars worth of consequences.

Mike Leach further shows his ‘loyalty’ by telling stories that conflict with the trainer’s, and team doctor’s affidavites…at least that is the way it looks…and the way it will look in court. Now, the affidavites themselves might be questioned. They are both dated 1Jan2010, were they tendered under duress? Is there a subtle, hidden threat of job security behind them ? We will never know, but they can be offered in court as valid and tested in that arena as a ‘my word against yours’ offering for a civil court to decide.

1) Once Mike Leach was fired, I’m not sure he owes his former employer a showing of “loyalty.” Indeed, Kent Hance owes Leach no loyalty, nor do we for that matter (except for appreciation for his efforts, if that is even warranted). The administration and Mike Leach are both in full-blown legal posturing mode, so the expectation of loyalty by either side for the other is bogus.

2) I disagree with your characterization of the affidavits as contradicting Mike Leach’s interview. I defer to London Raider on the issue, as I think his analysis has been spot on. I have watched the 36 minute interview. I read the affidavits. I do not find anything substantively different between the accounts presented by Leach, the trainer, or the team’s doctor.

3) The affidavits may help the administration in their shock value, but Leach’s lawyers, if they are competent at all, will have a lot of fun with the difference in tone between the statements signed on January 1st and those presented to media sources by the doctor and trainer prior to Leach’s firing. It appears that a lot of people, Lincoln Riley, Michael Phy, and the trainer to count a few, simply bet on the wrong horse at the beginning of this dispute. They all would have been better off, and the administration too, had everyone taken a more muted tone. A fact-finder will be very interested to find out what someone said, when they said it, for the purposes of deducing why they said it. The timing of the statements is suspicious, to say the least. Bias will be very easy to demonstrate.

When I heard ML was given a letter at the hearing, I knew the admin was ready to fire him and they knew he would possibly give them cause, again. He thought he could get away with sueing his employer’s admonishment tendered because he refused to sign an apology without further admonishment ?? That is insane, even reckless !! It speaks of a vindictive response, a narrow view of the world outside of his own judgement, inability to compromise or even look at a middle ground when everything is at stake.

The law takes a different position; there is nothing “insane” or “reckless” or “vindictive” about exercising one’s legal rights and remedies. In any event, there is no need to “look at a middle ground when everything is at stake” if it is the case that “the admin is ready to fire him.” At that point, there is nothing at stake; the employer has made a decision, and there is little the employee can do to stop them, absent the exercise of legal rights (such as a temporary restraining order/injunction which, on a side note, is pretty easy to win and I’m really surprised the admin chickened out on this; more than a few lawyers I know have commented on this, saying it was pretty chickenshit of them to avoid the TRO hearing).

Everyone understands that when a coach is fired, there is a lawsuit. The idea that Leach is insane for initiating a lawsuit confuses me. It is just as likely that Leach was a few steps ahead of the administration in initiating the injunction against the school, even if you think that led to his firing (which is, anyways, completely inconsistent with what you’ve said regarding why Leach was “really” fired).

Mike Leach is a very fine football coach and program leader, he assembled a good cast of coaches, and helped grow a good football program, but he was an horrible employee and that did him in at TTU and his further pursuit of the direction he has displayed will be considered by any worthwhile program that wants to hire a good coach.

The idea that a coahc could be very fine, a program leader, a great assembler of a cast of coaches, an solid at growing a good football program, but was still a “horrible employee” is what many of us find unsettling. That his inability to play politics, which is hardly considered a virtue by many of us, is enough to discount all the things he was good at (and that we paid him to be good at) is what needs explaining.

We could end up paying him millions, in which case his “marketability” will increase. I hope the school does not have to pay him millions, but it looks like a merited lawsuit.

And, yes—with a duh!, if you have made up your mind to take the opening given by the James affair to fire your coach, you do it before he is eligible for any completion bonus.

That creates serious legal issues. If it is the case that the administration used the James event to create a phony “for cause” firing against Mike Leach, than he’s going to have a simple time recovering 800k. You better keep quiet about what the administration intended, because if they are as calculating as you say they are, a lot of students are going to pay Mike Leach through tuition.

The whole deal is an ugly mess, it shows that the TTU admin is not going to deal with a difficult coach…

Except, apparently, for 10 years. The TTU administration are the goats here. Life will go on with Leach, but it isn’t clear that our program will ever succeed with this administration. We look like a bunch of bumbling opportunistic hicks in so far as we are represented by our administration. Mike Leach doesn’t look any better for his participation in this, but what good is that to us? He’s just another former head coach of the team. If his career is ruined, it’s just evidence to future potential hires what can happen if they join the Texas Tech family.

The saddest part is that everyone loses. Craig James career has lost luster. Adam James is likely done at TTU and in CFB generally. Texas Tech is much worse off for having lost a good coach and likely having to pay a non-trivial sum in a lawsuit. Mike Leach looks ever more strange and difficult to future employers. And the wrong that was allegedly righted, was never a wrong; Adam James was not put in danger by anyone. Except, I’d add, by the administration, who apparently reinforced to young James the worst lesson in life, that dad is a phone call away when you don’t get what you don’t deserve.

I disagree strongly that the TTU admin showed anything we wanted them to show the world. We look bad, just as everyone else does. That sucks. There should be accountability for this.

Go register. Or else.

by Skin Patrol on Jan 4, 2010 5:52 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

You had me until the call dad when you don't get what you deserve part.

Adam James deserves nothing. If he doesn’t earn it by his sweat or talent then he doesn’t get it.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 6:49 AM CST up reply actions  

Read carefully:)

“that dad is a phone call away when you don’t gte what you don’t deserve”

we’re on the same page

Go register. Or else.

by Skin Patrol on Jan 5, 2010 7:41 AM CST up reply actions  

Pretty much sums up my thoughts too, SP.

"I’ve established a reputation for integrity. I have maintained those high standards" - Craig James

by TechFirst on Jan 5, 2010 8:39 AM CST up reply actions  

Sorry, for my lack of ability to read.

I did graduate from Tech after all. : }

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 12:24 PM CST up reply actions  

I disagree

I disagree with several portions of your comment, but I will only address one because it has been mentioned in several other comments as well. That is that Mike’s filing for the TRO was a form of insubordination (or even poor judgment) in and of itself. The school cannot sign an employment contract with an employee and then fire the employee because he attempted to enforce the contract. Mike was trying to defend his right to remain the coach, which he felt was his right under the contract since the contract did not allow for a suspension (or at least a suspension without an investigation). I am not defending the merits of his argument, just that he has the right to enforce the contract that the school entered into. If I had a "for cause" employment contract and my employer chose to not abide by the provisions of the contract (extreme e.g., not pay my wages owed), and I attempted to enforce the contract, my employer should not be able to fire me "for cause" just for suing my employer for what is owed me under the contract.

by TTRedRaiderAlum on Jan 4, 2010 10:32 AM CST reply actions  

You Maybe Absolutely Accurate

About the law suit being other than a form of insubordination.

I took the words spoken by Hance to make my thoughts…back in Dimmit if you sue your boss he is going to fire you…words to that effect.

Thank you for your perspective.

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 11:33 PM CST up reply actions  

Too Big for Their Britches

I think many of the teams’ problems this year stem from the players’ (and maybe the coaches’) inability to deal with the instant fame they received last year as the result of the dramatic defeat of Texas, the rankings, and the primetime coverage.

From a performance standpoint, this was a pretty dismal year for Tech. 8-4, including 3 losses in conference (Big 12 South) games, a loss to Houston (who went on to lose to UTEP), and a near-loss to Baylor.

by Shallowater on Jan 4, 2010 10:36 AM CST reply actions  

A distinction should be made.

Being a head coach that raises the profile of an entire university exponentially and brings in more money than any other employee by far, should not be equated to being an average employee. As the the case made above clearly shows – it is incredibly difficult to see that Adam James was abused. Nothing about his treatment equate to real harm or even the potential for real harm so I will not that cloud the issue for me. I am in the camp that states James is dishonest and an instigator in this mess. As for the idea that Leach should be looked at like any other employee – I am intimately involved in hiring and firing at my company and I promise you, we don’t look for excuses to fire our top salesman. He is an ass around the office sometimes and he doesn’t do a lot of the piddly stuff we generally require sales staff to do as a normal part of their jobs , but his customers love him, he doesn’t break any laws and he performs his core duty better than anyone else in town. We make a lot off money off his efforts and our customer loyalty is through the roof. We could fire him over the “insubordinate behavior” in a heart beat – and trust me, it’s been discussed – but that would hurt the company terribly. Leach is not an average employee and the real world of business will always make exception for the high performers. That is good business. Firing him was simply not good business. What the administration has done at Tech is not good for the university and that is the bottom line when they are involved.

by Dunka on Jan 4, 2010 10:40 AM CST reply actions  

I think the treatment, while not physically abusive, could be seen in courts as violating his clause about treating players in general. I don’t have MLs contract handy, but I know there is something in there that addresses how he treats the athletes.

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 10:42 AM CST up reply actions  

I’d say to look at Rylan Reed’s letter if you’d like to see how Mike Leach treats his players.

HERE

by rpowel2 on Jan 4, 2010 11:42 AM CST up reply actions  

I think that Leach was great to Reed. Sure enough. I also think that the James kid has a claim that he wasn’t. You can be a swell guy to one kid and a total prick to another. Leach, of all people, clearly had a personality that was hard to define and his responses to the same situation were probably very different depending on who it was. Same as with me, honestly.

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 12:10 PM CST up reply actions  

They should have suspended Adam or somehow gotten him kicked off the team for insubordination and/or lack of effort. Sure maybe Mike plays a few favorites (who doesn’t), but I’ve been looking for one positive statement about Adam (by anyone) and I’m coming up empty. Accd to the “new” affidavit, Leach didn’t order the shed – only a dark place. I like Cap’ns legal case even though I’m no lawyer.

by rpowel2 on Jan 4, 2010 12:39 PM CST up reply actions  

One other point…yes, he was a high performing employee. But I think the bosses of that employee, as well as he performed, grew weary of dealing with him over a 10-year span. I’ve worked places where similar things happened to sales guys. They sold the crap out of the service, but acted like the company owed them a favor for employing them. That works for a while, but at some point you have to make a decision you feel is for the collective good of the entire organization. Happens all the time.

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 10:44 AM CST up reply actions  

Protecting our Interests

The men that run the university first and formost have a fiscal responsibility to the university. That applies to all departmetns atheletic being only one of those. The contract negotiation emails are very clear in that matter. We couldnt pay him if we wanted to, Leach wanted more than he was worth. He made PR moves to create anxiety amoung all of us and made moves concerning the team that could have created legal and thus financial problems in the atheletic department that would spill into the wellbeing of the University.

by Gus Mitchem on Jan 4, 2010 11:16 AM CST up reply actions  

They wanted to use it as leverage to assure the alumni that were donating to the stadium expansion that he would be here and that him being her would fill the new seats.

by ST04 on Jan 4, 2010 1:29 PM CST up reply actions  

Agree and disagree (naturally)

I agree that the wording of the contract would make it a legal possibility that he violated that clause. Not very likely based on what is public at the moment, but possible.

At least as of now, I think that firing Leach wasn’t for the collective good of the entire organization. I think it was for the good of a very few people who had self interest in mind.

by Dunka on Jan 4, 2010 11:20 AM CST up reply actions  

In my experience those self-promoters and top producers move on to bigger and better things – just kind of the nature of things nowadays. The old monoliths get left in the dust. I don’t think ML will be any different.

by rpowel2 on Jan 4, 2010 12:49 PM CST up reply actions  

Yes,

You S-Can the person that causes 90% of that high performing person’s issues. In this case, Myers out of the mix would have made this potentially work. I’ve seen that scenario in your hypothetical more than the high performing employee being shown the door.

by oldschoolraider on Jan 4, 2010 8:15 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

Nope, we gotta keep the 3rd rate ex B-Ball coach.

I love Tech, but this is not the first, nor will it be the last time that the Administration at Texas Tech will cause major *h*t storm at the University.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Jan 5, 2010 6:54 AM CST up reply actions  

fiscal responsibility

Indeed they do have a fiscal responsibility to the University and if the contract they agreed upon with Leach last year is part of that, if they were unable to meet the financial obligation of last years contracts debacle, then perhaps they should have not agreed to it?

What about the flipside to that coin and the revenue that leach generated for the University being part of their fiscal responsibility to maintain…Leach had good PR and bad PR…but the generally accepted PR view is that any is good and more is better

by jdangler on Jan 4, 2010 11:24 AM CST reply actions  

Collateral Damage

Fantastic work, on the surface we see only the Administration, Coach Leach, and the James gang’s perceptions. What about the players that are at Tech now, what did the fallout cost them, what about the the Seniors that are leaving to seek their futures. All the politics that are being played by so many so they can Hop scotch their way up the ladder. All the time the players are just getting stepped on, when they are the one’s that throw the passes, catch them, block, tackle , block kicks and score Touchdowns for our enjoyment. I wonder if the Administration,and THE JAMES GANG thought about any of those kids when they were rushing to judgement? I truly don’t think so,and it adds up to be a sad day. Mr. James your son was BOOED by the Tech fans, if you think for one minute you protected your son by your actions you are totally mistaken. What parent would put their child( I call mine a young MAN) on that stage when all you truly needed to do was bring him home, so I am not buying into the BS about protecting your child(your words)and other players from mistreatment. I did not once ever ask you to protect my son from anything, nor would I ever, seeing how you tear down things. He had a great game dispite the fact he had to avoid the sideshow you sent to San Antonio. My son had his picture in the program and you got your son’s picture put on Wanted Posters. I hope you are proud of your actions, you see, playing time isn’t about the money. You cost a good man his job and most of all you cost this program years of hard work, you say you love Texas Tech, please take your love elsewhere, we don’t need your love. My son loves Texas Tech and the people that truly support the program, but because of what transpired, we have a bittersweet ending. This really ended up about the money, you can smell the greed evrywhere.

by dbled53 on Jan 4, 2010 11:33 AM CST reply actions   2 recs

It isn't often I read a comment twice

rarely do words carry this much weight around here

by Quatroux on Jan 4, 2010 3:00 PM CST up reply actions  

Please tell # 53 THANK YOU for his effort and example over the past two years...

Best wishes to him for whatever may come after this year…
He epitomizes what I admire most about my favorite Texas Tech football players – 100% effort and 100% heart…

by Houston Raider on Jan 4, 2010 7:53 PM CST up reply actions  

I Agree

That had the James family had ultimate concern for their son, he would not have even played football. They know the hazards, they know the risks, both from the physical and from a coach who might chose to push a player to do more than he thinks he can while they know all along that he is capable of so much more. That is their burden. For one, I absolutely will not harbor negative feelings towards Adam James.

And yes, the James family postering is really suspicious, and kind of sticky sicky.

We all admire all the players who come out and play football while working to be good students and good citizens…whether they achieve at a high level on the field or not.

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 11:44 PM CST up reply actions  

I wonder...

how much revenue Tech generated from the primetime games last season and the Texas game this season.

and

whether Craig James had anything to do with ESPN’s decision to broadcast those games.

by Shallowater on Jan 4, 2010 11:33 AM CST reply actions  

My Aggie friends are loving the TTU drama.

They are circulating this among themselves and ltao at us. If you haven’t seen it, the site below is hilarious! You may have to cut and paste the link , but it’s worth it

http://vimeo.com/8460122

by TDSTAR on Jan 4, 2010 11:53 AM CST reply actions  

2 points

A)are you really admitting to aggie friends
b)surely you are deft enough to remind them that we own their ass and they should just shut the piehole

by oldschoolraider on Jan 4, 2010 8:21 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

You nailed it London

It almost comical to think Leach was fired over baby James especially sind Bob Knight was on the payroll at one time. Leach was in the cross hairs since the contract and if I’m hearing things correctly I’m starting to see a shift in opinions from some media types. The ticket in Dallas this morning had a discussion about it and even went as far as saying money was the real problem along with the AD relationship. No new news to us but I think the tide is shifting among non-ESPN affiliated broadcasters. It’s a large fraternity but I dont’s see a concensus of opinions being one sided for long. At the end of the day Leach will get all the money and nice coaching job somewhere. We of course will be broke with an average coach. I’m glad we had the 2008 team in my lifetime.

"You've got to find your inner pirate" - Mike Leach

by Raider1992 on Jan 4, 2010 11:54 AM CST reply actions  

Yes

That Bob Knight’s actions were acceptable and Mike Leach’s were not is the thought that leads to my conclusion that Mike Leach was on the verge of being fired anyway and that the James deal was the ‘opportunity.’ I can change my thinking as soon as I see something rational that explains that.

I find myself tonight wondering how much they really wanted him gone…the DMN emails hint that the admin was weary of working with him and wanted Briles…at least Sowell wrote about that from his perspective (I guess it is not automatic that we was speaking for the others in those exchanges—I would need to read them again to see if I could get a sense of that one way or the other). The reason I am wondering if they really wanted him gone is that they seem to be unprepared to have a coaching search prepared. They were certainly prepared at the hearing with a letter of dismissal in case they needed it…so one might think they would be prepared to interview a great list of prospective coaches. I am not seeing that…

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 11:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Which Movie are we Watching?

Good analysis. As to point one, clearly there was no risk of additional physical injury. The only potential injury is emotional or psychological, as Leach clearly wanted to rattle sabres with the mutinous Mr. James. Probably not enough for Tech to meet its burden of proof on the contract issue. As to point two, deviation from medical standard of care, that is an opinion which one doctor gives about care by another doctor, not care by a football coach. Leach isn’t an MD. He isn’t putting James in the shed for medical treatment. This is the old red herring, rabbit chasing argument. Not relevant whether Leach deviated from medical standard of care because Leach is not a medical doctor, unlike Bones McCoy. If I’m handicapping the legal battle, I think Leach is sitting on a good Plaintiff’s case. He’s got good liability facts, good damages facts, and a deep pocket on the other end. The only downside on his end is he can be a bit of an arrogant jerk, which may hurt him in front of a jury.

Which leads me to my question? The James camp portrays a scene not unlike the old Robby Benson movie, “One on One”, where the evil coach was cruel to the player to try to get him to quit. The Leach camp portrays more of a “First Blood: Rambo” picture, where the old establishment drew first blood against the protagonist to run him out of town.

Which movie are we watching?

by Oklahoma Red Raider on Jan 4, 2010 12:11 PM CST reply actions  

Golic

Mike Golic seems to have it right. This a.m. he admitted that Leach made a dumb mistake by blurring the line between treatment and discipline, but that this is about the contract negotitiations, the money owed, and the relationship betweem ML and GM.

by Red Raider in South GA on Jan 4, 2010 12:32 PM CST reply actions  

This will play out much different in court, in my opinion

For one thing, there will be no wishy-washy answers and no “non-denial denials.” For example, James pere was accused of saying that he would trade favorable on-air comments for more playing time for James fils. His response was “That’s absurd.” That might work in blogs or on espn (an acronym I can no longer capitalize, much like the ncaa or the other school in Los Angeles, just$c), but it will not work in front of a jury. James pere will be asked to please answer the question without characterizing it — did he make the statement to Coach Leach, yes or no. When he denies it, as he must, then Coach Leach’s lawyer will play the evidence (which I’m sure a smart guy like your Coach would have preserved.)

And there’s more, of course. The lack of any consensus about whether a kid has or doesn’t have a concussion and how to treat it will make the administration look foolish. For example, anyone who has gotten plastered on a Saturday night has all the symptoms of a mild concussion on Sunday morning.

The bottom line for me is that Coach Leach’s lawyers will put the school and the administrators and Boss Hogg (aka Mr. Sowell) and James pere and fils on trial and will in all likelihood make them look silly.

We all tend to look at these things based on our own particular background and experience. Mine is in the courthouse arena. My experience says this has a major potential to be a financial disaster for the defendants, who I think will include James pere. There is no way that he ends up looking reasonable to a jury, in my opinion. If I were advising Texas Tech, I would tell them that they’re likely to lose and they should buy their peace as quickly and cheaply as then can. If it’s a matter of principle for the school, then they need to be prepared to pay a ton in defense costs after which they will still lose.

An outsider’s opinion, which isn’t probably worth a whole lot.

by Fox 71 on Jan 4, 2010 1:00 PM CST reply actions   1 recs

Fox, Are any of these personally liable?

What of…

Boss Hogg
Pere and fils James
Henchman Hance, Myers, anyone else at Tech

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 1:14 PM CST up reply actions  

You have a couple of squadrons of Texas lawyers here, and I'm a California lawyer.

Under California law, you generally can’t sue an individual who works for the entity who breached the contract. In the insurance business, where I’ve done most of my work, a plaintiff can sue the insurer for bad faith (a tort) or breach of contract, but not the adjuster who actually breached the contract or committed the bad faith. (That law goes way, way back.) As I understand it, California law wouldn’t allow any of the Three Stooges (the co-employees) to be sued for intentional interference with a contractual relationship.

But Boss Hogg? Sure. I’m sure he’s got more lawyers on his payroll than (fill in appropriate West Texas figure of speech), but his hands are very very dirty, considering the e-mails. (Also, anyone who puts stuff like that in writing is not particularly bright, and will probably have an easily pushable button on cross-examination which will make the jury hate him. He’ll probably show up in court in the white suit and big white hat and cigar with his minion Roscoe with him, but I digress.) As pointed out elsewhere, if Texas has a cause of action for intentional interference with a contract or with a prospective economic advantage, then Boss Hogg could be well and truly on a hook. And he looks far from judgment-proof, from what I’ve heard.

Craig and Adam? I wouldn’t sue Adam because that would be perceived as overreaching. And Adam didn’t do anything that any other spoiled child wouldn’t do, and that’s run to daddy when he doesn’t get his way. Craig, on the other hand, and his employer have a major issue. I would not sue for defamation, because Coach Leach is a public figure and his lawyer would have to prove actual malice on Daddy’s part, and that’s hard to prove. The same interference with contract causes of action would also lie against Craig, in my opinion. He was trying to get the coach at least embarrassed, if not fired. Either way, he’s interfering with the contractual relationship.

Under California law, there is a thing called the Unfair Competion Law which most plaintiff’s lawyers include in every complaint. It’s been reined in a bit in the past few years, but it still has teeth. I’m confident that Texas has something similar.

The bottom line, in my off-the-top-of-my head, non-researched opinion, is that there are much more remedies available than simply breach of contract. There are tort remedies which could include punitives. (Punitives are not recoverable on a breach of contract cause of action in California.) I’m a defense lawyer, but I would still love to take the Coach’s case (with a suitable major league trial jock sitting in the first chair, and of course if that happens, the major league trial jock doesn’t need a second chair.)

by Fox 71 on Jan 4, 2010 2:06 PM CST up reply actions   2 recs

Should have previewed - I left out espn

Would they be liable? Obvously James pere was their employee, and espn knew in advance what he was going to say, so maybe they can be held in as his employer. I would name them and take discovery against them, because they will come off looking bad because of the obvious absence of objectivity or investigation. Plus, it’s another giant standing nest to the Goliaths who are already sitting at the defense table because of what they tried to do with the quirky but brilliant Coach David.

by Fox 71 on Jan 4, 2010 2:13 PM CST up reply actions  

Fox, wouldn't you expect the suit to be filed quickly?

I was expecting to hear about something filed today actually. Don’t they want to get in on record asap and impede the potential for destruction of evidence? Or, is it so complicated that Leach et al should take the time to research carefully? Or, could they even be discussing a pre-litigation settlement right now as we speak?

by DFWTrojan on Jan 4, 2010 3:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Quickly is relative

It will take a while to draft a complaint. This is not an auto v auto case. Next week will be soon enough. What I don’t expect to see are any more statements by any of the principals.

by Fox 71 on Jan 4, 2010 3:54 PM CST up reply actions  

If I'm Leach ...

I’m having my team work the settlement angle HARD … probably my best bet, especially if I want to be hired into a new situation, soon -

"Fearless champions ever be; Stand on heights of victory"

by Let's Go Tech! on Jan 4, 2010 4:04 PM CST up reply actions  

ESPN Mail Call Just Reported...

Mike Leach Locked a Player in a CAGE!!! Part of the discussion about weather or not he’ll coach again.

4:50 Central Time, Jan. 4

They are TRULY not concerned about any legal or public opinion backlash.

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 4:58 PM CST up reply actions  

Coach's case

I would love to have it, too. It would be like shootin’ fish in a barrell.

By the way, the fact pattern on this case would make a great law school exam question.

by Oklahoma Red Raider on Jan 4, 2010 3:59 PM CST up reply actions  

In court

Generally agree with your assessment of how this would play out in court. The only reservation which I would have, from the Leach side of the equation, is whether he is going to come across to a jury as arrogant. This would affect recovery of any extra-contractual damages by him for a retaliatory discharge claim. Nevertheless, his claim for contractual damages is huge.

I am concerned about what, if any, legal advice Tech got from its counsel prior to setting these events into motion. Their playbook has called for one mistake after another.

On issue of personal liability, I am not familiar with Texas law, however, if they can show e-mails from Boss Hogg after the contract was signed in February, 2009, it seems as though there would be a claim for tortious interference with a contractual relationship against Boss Hogg (and pere James, for that matter). It would sure make all of their clandestine communications discoverable.

by Oklahoma Red Raider on Jan 4, 2010 1:38 PM CST up reply actions  

End The Charade

Lou Holtz said it best. How many players received concussions in the ten years Mike Leach coached at Tech? How many of those players received the same “treatment” that James did for their concussions?

Mike Leach was punishing a player with a concussion because he thought that player was soft, and or because he thought the player’s dad was a PITA. That gave the Administration the reason that they needed for suspendining him – then he gave them the reason to fire him.

Leach is gone because it was always about him, not the school, not the players, and not Pirates. He put us on the map as a football program for that we should be proud, but he was also an embarrassment in interviews. Sure the media called him quirky. It is sort of like the difference between crazy and eccentric. Poor people are crazy – rich people are eccentric. Successful coaches are quirky, unsuccessful coaches are horses butt’s.

by shootsone on Jan 4, 2010 2:31 PM CST reply actions  

you just don't get it

as the post says this is not about concussed players. This is about slackers and little league dads. It is my understand that Leach had a standing policy that EVERYONE comes to practice in appropriate “gear”. When Sweet Baby James came in shades, hat on backwards, etc, he was bannished to the shed for ,ironically ,insubordination. My guess is that over the past other players doing similar stupid things received similar consequences.

by blackbeard on Jan 4, 2010 3:07 PM CST up reply actions  

BB, I think you and shootsone are actually on the same side of this.

by Tech92 on Jan 4, 2010 3:14 PM CST up reply actions  

Right

James was not put in a dark place because he had a concussion, he was placed in a dark spot because the doctor told him he needed to protect his eyes and he came to practice not dressed for practice as was required of the other players on light duty, wearing a pair of shades and whith his hat on backwards (a hat with a bill is sun protection for one’s eyes.) When questioned about his shades, he alluded to the doctor’s comments and Mike Leach sent him to the dark in a bit of an angry response, somewhat sarcastic in nature, for most of us not a big deal kind of thing…reported to be accompanied by a good cuss’in.

It was his attitude, non team, individualistic me over my team mates kind of stuff.

by TallMike on Jan 4, 2010 11:59 PM CST up reply actions  

Sticks

What about his treatment of Sheffield? When the story broke I knew for sure it was about him being on the field at OSU. He wasnt recovered from the broken foot and being chased by guys trying to break his other leg. This tells me that there might be more to the story than just this James BS.

by Gus Mitchem on Jan 4, 2010 4:06 PM CST reply actions  

Where's the pillowcase of dead puppies?

video footage of Leach clubbong baby seals?
trunk full of dead strippers?

If Tech hides the smoking gun in a sealed court document they will still lose in the court of public opinion. That’s the court my money and I follow.

by Quatroux on Jan 4, 2010 4:27 PM CST reply actions  

Leach and TTU "Admin"

Concussion: Potts watched practice from that same press room when he had his concussion…. same treatment as Adam James

Chancellor: Hance’s JOB is to generate income for Tech, mostly from donations. Donations from the average Tech fan are already down.
 
Trainer & doctor: Anybody else wonder why they changed their stories?

New coach: I’ve gotten the impression (talked with numerous TT alums while in D/FW over holidays) that the Dallas-based regents would prefer a “wine & cheese taster” coach over anyone else. Is John Mackovic still available?

Money: In order for us to affect Tech’s bottom line, the people who are threatening to cancel season tickets need to follow through. That hasn’t happened as prices have gone up, and Admin surely thinks loyal Raider fans will continue to spend our money.

Myers: Gerald has always wanted Tech to be a basketball school, with USA attendance higher than Jones Stadium.

Sorry for incomplete previous post… kbd is acting up.

by raiderfan34 on Jan 4, 2010 8:25 PM CST reply actions  

Didn't an affidavit assert that no other concussed players had be sent to the shed?

I thought it was one of the issues Tech was trying to use against Leach and the way he supposedly singled out James…

Where did you hear Potts had been placed there.

by raider realist on Jan 4, 2010 8:38 PM CST reply actions  

The affidavit said

that if other players had been sent to the shed he was not aware of it.

Big difference.

by Shallowater on Jan 4, 2010 9:46 PM CST up reply actions  

Potts in shed, too

Potts showed up to workout in sweats (properly), but trainers were already aware of “headaches & shade”

Also, several players LAST YEAR were in the press room or garage when they had concussions that trainers were treating.

Got this from a present player. Sorry, no name or #; don’t want him in trouble.

by raiderfan34 on Jan 4, 2010 9:55 PM CST reply actions  

Is this "twist" plausible ...

Read a comment in the Dallas Morning News that referred to Coach Leach’s contract. Specifically, because his contract has no provisions for being “suspended”, only “terminated”, the University’s act of suspension was a violation of the contract.

Legal beagles … help me out here. Could this be plausible?

Coach Leach’s contract (a 10-page pdf file) is available here:
http://i.usatoday.net/sports/graphics/2009/coaches-contracts/pdf/leach_texastech.pdf

by N86MZ on Jan 5, 2010 12:41 AM CST reply actions  

you're not alone

I’m not a TT fan, but like a ton of folks around the country, have been following this story closely. First because I always enjoyed Mick Leach’s antics. Secondly, it has become evident that ESPN lost any veneer of objectivity they ever may have had.

You TT fans deserve a better administration. The one you have cannot be trusted. Mike Leach is going to be coaching next year. I’m sorry for your loss. He’s not going to be easy to replace.

Cheers, and here’s to better days.

by MI_Fanboi on Jan 5, 2010 4:08 PM CST reply actions  

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